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COMSOL dynamic biphasic fea model?

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Hello,

I am looking for any nonlinear FEA software available that can analyze dynamic (oscillatory) movement of a biphasic (porous solid saturated with liquid) tissue. We are trying to get a dynamic model of vocal fold vibration. Would anyone know whether COMSOL would be able to model that?

Thank you very much for any feedback.

8 Replies Last Post Jul 11, 2011, 4:14 p.m. EDT
Jeff Hiller COMSOL Employee

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Posted: 1 decade ago Jul 1, 2011, 3:47 p.m. EDT
I know very little about vocal folds and their modeling, but Google Scholar finds a bunch of papers with the query string "vocal fold + COMSOL":
scholar.google.com/scholar?q=vocal+fold+%2B+COMSOL&hl=en&btnG=Search&as_sdt=1%2C22&as_sdtp=on

I hope it helps.
I know very little about vocal folds and their modeling, but Google Scholar finds a bunch of papers with the query string "vocal fold + COMSOL": http://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=vocal+fold+%2B+COMSOL&hl=en&btnG=Search&as_sdt=1%2C22&as_sdtp=on I hope it helps.

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Posted: 1 decade ago Jul 1, 2011, 4:04 p.m. EDT
Thank you for the reply. I am specifically looking for software that can analyze a biphasic elastic material dynamically. This has never been applied to vocal folds before. COMSOL has been used to analyze vocal folds before, but they were not modeled as a biphasic material, and that is what comes up in google scholar.
Thank you for the reply. I am specifically looking for software that can analyze a biphasic elastic material dynamically. This has never been applied to vocal folds before. COMSOL has been used to analyze vocal folds before, but they were not modeled as a biphasic material, and that is what comes up in google scholar.

Jeff Hiller COMSOL Employee

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Posted: 1 decade ago Jul 1, 2011, 4:56 p.m. EDT
I am clearly out of my range here, but what you describing sounds to me like it may be similar to the poroelastic modeling that's feasible with the Subsurface Flow Module (i.e. mechanical behavior of a porous saturated medium, including transients).
Can you say more about how you want the "biphasicity" of the material to affect the equations governing the mechanical model?
I am clearly out of my range here, but what you describing sounds to me like it may be similar to the poroelastic modeling that's feasible with the Subsurface Flow Module (i.e. mechanical behavior of a porous saturated medium, including transients). Can you say more about how you want the "biphasicity" of the material to affect the equations governing the mechanical model?

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Posted: 1 decade ago Jul 6, 2011, 6:10 p.m. EDT
Hello,

We would like a poroviscoelastic biphasic model that is able to describe some or all of the following: liquid motion, solid stress fields, solid-liquid interaction, and continuity and momentum equations that describe momentum exchange between the liquid and solid components. I have included a short attachment with the equations describing our biphasic model.

Thank You,
Anton
Hello, We would like a poroviscoelastic biphasic model that is able to describe some or all of the following: liquid motion, solid stress fields, solid-liquid interaction, and continuity and momentum equations that describe momentum exchange between the liquid and solid components. I have included a short attachment with the equations describing our biphasic model. Thank You, Anton


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Posted: 1 decade ago Jul 7, 2011, 2:02 p.m. EDT
I'm currently working with a poroelastic model too. My model is a beam undergone a unconfined compression by a permanent load on the top side boundary, only the fluid is not viscous.
I used the 'equation based PDE' module with 3 variables: axial and radial displacements (for cylindrical system without shear stresses) and hydraulic pressure. For fitting the equations to this module, I rearranged the governing equations of poroelasticity so they depend only these 3 variables.
I don't know if there is a better way to do this with comsol.
I'm currently working with a poroelastic model too. My model is a beam undergone a unconfined compression by a permanent load on the top side boundary, only the fluid is not viscous. I used the 'equation based PDE' module with 3 variables: axial and radial displacements (for cylindrical system without shear stresses) and hydraulic pressure. For fitting the equations to this module, I rearranged the governing equations of poroelasticity so they depend only these 3 variables. I don't know if there is a better way to do this with comsol.

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Posted: 1 decade ago Jul 8, 2011, 5:29 p.m. EDT
Thanks for the info. Is the compression you are modeling dynamic or quasi-static? The most important aspect in our model is that it has to be dynamic and poroelastic. Subsurface flow Module looks somewhat promising, and I will take a look at the equation based PDE Module too.
Thanks for the info. Is the compression you are modeling dynamic or quasi-static? The most important aspect in our model is that it has to be dynamic and poroelastic. Subsurface flow Module looks somewhat promising, and I will take a look at the equation based PDE Module too.

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Posted: 1 decade ago Jul 8, 2011, 6:59 p.m. EDT
I don't know what is dynamic in your model, but my model is time-dependent. It means that a permanent surface load generates time-dependent displacements of the tissue, thus a time-dependent pressure inside. However, the tissue parameters such as Lamé constants, permeability coefficient are constants except for the Young's modules which depend on the displacement rate at each instance.
In your case, if only the tissue parameters are time-dependent, you can use the 'Parametric' study for a static 'Physics'. if your equations has time derivative terms, a 'time-dependent' study will be inevitable. if only the frequency analysis interests you, it would be necessary to change the equations to frequency-domain, then the problem can be treated as static but with 'parametric' study.
I hope this could help.
I don't know what is dynamic in your model, but my model is time-dependent. It means that a permanent surface load generates time-dependent displacements of the tissue, thus a time-dependent pressure inside. However, the tissue parameters such as Lamé constants, permeability coefficient are constants except for the Young's modules which depend on the displacement rate at each instance. In your case, if only the tissue parameters are time-dependent, you can use the 'Parametric' study for a static 'Physics'. if your equations has time derivative terms, a 'time-dependent' study will be inevitable. if only the frequency analysis interests you, it would be necessary to change the equations to frequency-domain, then the problem can be treated as static but with 'parametric' study. I hope this could help.

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Posted: 1 decade ago Jul 11, 2011, 4:14 p.m. EDT
The Comsol support said that The 'earth science' module can also be used for this kind of problem.
The Comsol support said that The 'earth science' module can also be used for this kind of problem.

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